Appreciating media

[Jenius]

How do you guys do it? I hear music and I really only like it through an aesthetics standpoint. I see art and I really can only appraise the visual quality. I read a novel and I focus primarily on how compelling the narrative is. I watch a film and I hardly notice things beyond the story.

That's not to say I can't notice critical things if I'm trying to, but I'm the kind of person who read the Narnia books and didn't notice all the religious connotations.

I can read books/poems/look at art/etc for school classes and analytically appraise them if I'm required to do so, but if I'm just doing something on my leisure time I tend to not focus too much on it. I get bored of completely stock things and tend to like stuff that isn't completely mindless, but whenever people start talking about art/music/films/lit I tend to feel completely lost because I never really got deep into that sort of thing.

Is this something that if I wanted to correct, should I primarily do so just by going through oftenly talked about pieces?

And should I even bother? What are the advantages of it? I can't say I've ever felt my life was missing something, but sometimes when people namedrop I feel a bit uncultured because I only vaguely know what they're talking about and it's generally a foggy memory of something that was briefly mentioned in high school.

Also, how do you get the time to maintain knowledge in such things? I'm at maximum credits without going over the limit and getting charged additional, and I have a job that eats up a large chunk of my week. When I do have freetime I'm generally tired and just crash with friends etc. Where in your schedule do you fit in the newest piece of literature/etc you want to add your memory? Is it a leisurely thing you simply enjoy, or is it more of a rewarding hobby that isn't quite relaxation?

Mainly this could have been a PM to Shady because I'm curious as to what I'm missing out on. Though really, it seems almost everyone that frequents here knows way more about everything not related to hard sciences than me, so pretty much anyone can share their thoughts :V.

[Jenius]

:'(

[LegendShark]

I'm with you on music and art, but you'd think it would be easy to analyse a movie as you were watching it or a book as you're reading it.

It's not exactly cryptography.

[Jenius]

I'm with you on music and art, but you'd think it would be easy to analyse a movie as you were watching it or a book as you're reading it.

It's not exactly cryptography.

Well it's not that I can't, it's just not something I do naturally or for entertainment purposes. Maybe it's an acquired taste or something.

Also this is one of the few threads I actually want BT to post in >_>.

Edit: Shady you said you'd post later, don't forget!

[LegendShark]

Well it's not that I can't, it's just not something I do naturally or for entertainment purposes. Maybe it's an acquired taste or something.

Eh. While its superficial and kind of boring to just read something for it's awesome plot and not try to find any underlying themes, it does feel really good. Which is why Shoot em Up was a very entertaining movie. Not really "good" in any sense of the word, but extremely entertaining.

[Tidal Kraken]

smoke some drugs

[mrs_bun]

The same way you can appreciate chemistry or learn a language. Just curiosity, I spose. Thinking about art isn't like "lmao glissandi r dum" or anything. Being critical of art is really just noticing how it all comes together. Knowing the details doesn't help appreciate so much as it lets you discuss the appreciation, I think, share what you think is interesting in terms other ppl get beyond "I really like this, it's neat." There are no bad elements in art, so it isn't a matter of knowing what themes work and what don't; frinstance, most people mock Jerry Bruckheimer movies, but the elements common to his movies are also used in some really great, critically acclaimed movies.

I guess you could say there isn't a "how" to learning it; it's jsut rote, like learning a language, jsut till it comes naturally. :)

[BlaineTog]

How do you guys do it? I hear music and I really only like it through an aesthetics standpoint. I see art and I really can only appraise the visual quality. I read a novel and I focus primarily on how compelling the narrative is. I watch a film and I hardly notice things beyond the story.I think mrs bunn got most of it, actually. There's no magical incantation or anything, it's just sheer curiosity. Something impresses you or you notice a bit of a pattern and you want to

Though music and the visual arts are largely beyond me, mind you. I like listening to music, but I got into it kinda late (never really listened to much music before I got an iPod for my high school graduation) and still have trouble even picking out the lyrics until I've heard the song at least a dozen times, though I do try to follow the music to pinpoint just which parts I like the most. Visual art... well, I have some vague aesthetic preferences, but I was never really any good at visual art, and I tend to be less interested in artistic forms that I can't work in.

The single most important question, I find, is, "what is this trying to do here?" In a movie, for example, what does it mean that this character always wears blues and that character talks in this particular way? What is it trying to get at?

And should I even bother? What are the advantages of it? I can't say I've ever felt my life was missing something, but sometimes when people namedrop I feel a bit uncultured because I only vaguely know what they're talking about and it's generally a foggy memory of something that was briefly mentioned in high school.Well, being well-read can help you make decisions better if you think of everything you've ever read as a thought experiment. In that sense, the beauty of a piece is how well it emulates reality, how right it feels. It helps you spot the patterns of things, which means you can more easily latch on to good patterns and avoid bad ones. It also helps to cultivate the sense of wonder that makes life so much more transcendent. You certainly don't need to work on appreciating art to do this, as moments of beauty happen in the real world all the time. They just happen to be packed so densely that they're often hard to spot, whereas art is clearly labeled and clipped free of the fray.

Also, how do you get the time to maintain knowledge in such things? I'm at maximum credits without going over the limit and getting charged additional, and I have a job that eats up a large chunk of my week. When I do have freetime I'm generally tired and just crash with friends etc. Where in your schedule do you fit in the newest piece of literature/etc you want to add your memory? Is it a leisurely thing you simply enjoy, or is it more of a rewarding hobby that isn't quite relaxation?I actually have a real problem with finding time to read. Granted, it's mostly because I waste a lot of time online or playing video games, but it's undeniable that reading for leisure isn't quite as leisurely as just watching TV or something.

Movies are a good way to get your art fix since you can watch them while hanging out with your friends. They're also easy to watch.

[LegendShark]

The greatest thing about appreachiating media is that you can take anything any way you want it. Not even the author can tell you what the deeper meaning of a book is, and as long as you back up your opinions with solid facts you can be right.

My biggest problem in High School English was that my teacher freshman year spoiled me by telling me my opinions about a book were always right if I backed them up (And you can be wrong about something if there's no evidence for it. You have to not be stupid) and then my teacher sophomore year just took objects from the book we were reading and said "this is a symbol for that." And if you disagreed, well then you were wrong.

And it pissed me off because it was like she wouldn't let us think. Which also destroyed every book we read in that class, though we read some great ones like The Count of Monte Cristo and All Quiet on the Western Front.

Its good to think about things. What they mean, why they are the way they are. It's all about interest, and I guess curiosity as well.

[mrs_bun]

Read always.

[LegendShark]

Read always.

Speaking of which, I saw Atlas Shrugged at a Barnes and Nobles and picked it up by your request.

It's longs as hell though, and I don't know when I'll have time to read it.

[mrs_bun]

Haha, tricked you, it sucks! :P

Jk. It really is one of my faves. I kinda like how hated it is by some people. XP Iono, I feel like hating it is just intellectual bs for its own sake. Although the people who hate it prolly feel the same way about the book itself. :V

[Van]

My biggest problem in High School English was that my teacher freshman year spoiled me by telling me my opinions about a book were always right if I backed them up (And you can be wrong about something if there's no evidence for it. You have to not be stupid) and then my teacher sophomore year just took objects from the book we were reading and said "this is a symbol for that." And if you disagreed, well then you were wrong
I had a combination of those two teachers during Junior and Senior year (same guy). He would lead us into discussions where we backed up our opinions of the book, then would finish off each point by what it "really" meant. He did this more in Junior year than my AP English class, just because he had to give us some indication of what would be on the tests. :V

Of all the media, I think Literature is the easiest to find deeper meaning in. In many cases, the author simply tells you what the theme is or pounds a symbol into your head. Simply reading a lot can help you catch references an author makes to other classic works, many of which have very obvious themes. If it's still difficult, I would suggest reading a book for fun and trying to catch certain things, then google some discussion on it or use sparknotes to find the obvious symbols. I always found that the more I read, the easier it was for me to catch certain important themes of the book. I was lost as all hell trying to understand the point of Great Expectations in sophomore year, but the meanings of all my AP books were much more obvious. Granted, it could have been because the books had very fucking obvious themes in them ("What is a symbol in The Scarlet Letter?" :V)


I think that it is very hard to truly appreciate music or art without being a musician or artist, or at least trained in their principles. While a piece of music may sound good or a painting may look beautiful, it may not be very thematically structured. Limp Bizkit and the Dungeons and Dragons Monster Manual are not that deep. Pollock paintings look like a retarded mis-match of colors that any kindergartner could do, but his paintings actually do have subtle patterns within them and convey certain emotions embedded within the chaos. Not to mention any analysis of his unique choices of media. There are other things that only people who study art are really aware of and notice as well. In music, almost every decision in composition can imply something. Tempos, keys, modal changes, signature changes, the use of space and layering, onomatopoeia, ect. are all used to illustrate the thematic elements. My suggestion is to not listen to any modern music to look deeper into. Look for something with more obvious overtones, namely classical music, opera, jazz, and the blues. It tends to be pretty easy to see the decisions the artist made and why.

I will not comment on appreciating movies because for the life of me I don't know how to see a movie as anything other than entertainment. :V

[Tony3]

i think its also a bit of experience

like i have no experience with art and as a result i cant really appreciate great art. like if i had no context of the artists and i had never seen the painting, i'd be hard pressed to decide if a da vinci or some nameless (reasonably good) artist did a painting.

music i can understand and how its about layering, textures, musicality, technical demands etc. but thats because i hear and experience it atleast 5 hours a day.

movies are probably easiest to understand because its symbolism and symbolism is pulled from every day life and ideals.

[SizzlingStapleCider]

I am learning to do it with movies by, well, watching a lot of movies!

[Jenius]

I think my main problem is it tends to feel like a chore. I can't say I've come across one piece of good lit I've had to read via school wherein reading didn't feel like a chore.

I do appreciate your guy's advice though, I didn't tl;dr any post.

[Zerg]

hard sciences:rip:

[notallama]

i generally don't get symbolysm at all, unless it's spelled out for me.

even obvious hints won't do it; they actually have to say "this is a symbol!"

[Jenius]

i generally don't get symbolysm at all, unless it's spelled out for me.

even obvious hints won't do it; they actually have to say "this is a symbol!"
Symbols are pretty easy to recognize because of how loud they are :teach:.

[mrs_bun]

even obvious hints won't do it; they actually have to say "this is a symbol!"

Do you mean cymbal? o_O

[Van]

Do you mean cymbal? o_O

/facepalm x 2

One for pointing out the obvious joke. One for not quoting the right post :V

[mrs_bun]

This is what I was just talking about with the bad jokes hehehe. :P

[mrs_bun]

Also +1 point for Jenius doing it before me but after the post I quoted. XP

[notallama]

simba was a lion.

[mrs_bun]

You are thinking of Simba.

[notallama]

yeah.

[mrs_bun]

I was going for some sorta Rikkuish post, but I don't remember the joke I was setting up. XP

[notallama]

i just generally strive for pinky levels of associative powers.

[Van]

llama, you seem to constantly shift between one of the best posters on TS to Rikku levels of pointless drivel like some sort of sine wave of suck.

Be moar consistent so I know if I should hate you or not :V

[notallama]

most people are never truely asleep, and never truely awake. they just hover around at different levels of doze.

also, i like rikku.

[mrs_bun]

I like Rikku too, but I get the impression she hates everyone.

[notallama]

i think there's probably a reason for that.

[Shadow]

llama, you seem to constantly shift between one of the best posters on TS to Rikku levels of pointless drivel like some sort of sine wave of suck.

Be moar consistent so I know if I should hate you or not :V

You suck because if you think about it all of nal's posts are well constructed.

[Van]

You suck because if you think about it all of nal's posts are well constructed.

So are mine. I probably have more complete sentences per post than any other member on the source.

I admit not a lot of them are good, but I least get a coherant thought across almost all of the time, and I attempt to make my posts more interesting then Facebook comments.

[Shadow]

So are mine. I probably have more complete sentences per post than any other member on the source.

I admit not a lot of them are good, but I least get a coherant thought across almost all of the time, and I attempt to make my posts more interesting then Facebook comments.

Maybe nal doesn't have the most complete sentences but all the posts are good. Trust me.

[Van]

Maybe nal doesn't have the most complete sentences but all the posts are good. Trust me.

...

Does he have some secret posts that only you can see? What the fuck is the "Trust me" for?

I didn't say nal was a shitty poster overall. I know how good a poster he is, so it pisses me off when he makes stupid short posts that remind me of our Sourcettes.

[Shadow]

I'm saying the so called shitty posts are actually good ones.

:V

[Van]

rite

[Shadow]

Wait, did you assume I was trying to call you a shitty poster?

Cause... this is still me. :V

[Van]

Wait, did you assume I was trying to call you a shitty poster?

Cause... this is still me. :V

There's always less to it than that :V