TF2

[Kant]

So scout update is coming up soon, who's psyched for that?

[Shadow]

I am, sorta? I know I'm going to cheat for the new stuff so it doesn't really matter that much for me.

[Kant]

Yeah, I'm definately not going to do an achievement sever again, because my heavy, medic, and pyro stats are ÷÷÷÷ing retarded.

[Van]

Scout Update?!

*looks it up*

[Van]

÷÷÷÷, there's not actually any information on it yet :/

[Penner]

Yeah, I'm definately not going to do an achievement sever again, because my heavy, medic, and pyro stats are ÷÷÷÷ing retarded.

QFT. Plus, the scout stats are something that I would actually like to keep.

Anyone else happy that they balanced the crits last patch? I've actually noticed the difference quite a bit.

[Kant]

I love my scout stats because of one Goldrush game where I, as a scout, dominated the entire team.

Like, I got 20 points in 1 round alone, and 19 kills in said round. That would probably be my highest score, if not for the fact that my highest # of kills is 450 kills as a medic.

[ROFLCOPTER]

I can't wait until the scout update comes. Well... I sorta can. It's rather hard to backstab people as a spy when they run faster than you. :V

[Kant]

We should play on one server.

[ROFLCOPTER]

I'm on a lot. The only thing that really takes up my time is work for about 6 hours on Fridays and Saturdays.

[Shadow]

I got 31 points in one life as a sniper. And that's my best by far. I'm not really good with anything else.

[Jenius]

I pretty much stopped playing TF2 when the updates starting rolling. Not saying I don't like the new weps and such, I just got tired of half the server being one class, and most teamates doing unproductive achievement farming (like pyros sitting in water with shotty to get plan B).

When I did play I played scout though. My best run was somewhere in the teens iirc but scouts are harder to farm points with then most classes.

[ROFLCOPTER]

discounting the achievement server I went to as Pyro, 24 points as a Spy. That's 10 backstabs and a couple of saps in one life.

[Jenius]

My highest points in general I think is demoman or engineer but shit I can't remember. I generally don't play on servers large enough where getting an excessive amount of kills off noobs is a reasonable feat.

[Kant]

Best moment was orange x2 playing as an engie.

Managed to get a lvl3 SG in their spawn.

After I was killed (after like 19 points--this was a 7v7 server), I switched to pyro, which I guess was when people decided to ÷÷÷÷÷.

somekid:Goddamnit, Gerlach is spawncamping with an SG
Gerlach-...he says to a pyro

[Pfisiar]

I play TF2 a lot. I have 71 hours on Engineer and close to 50 hours on Pyro. And that's only within the last 3 months, I think.

Anyways, I play on XPG servers mostly. The 2fort party mod server with low grav. Makes demoman a bit nutty, but cool otherwise.

I won't play on servers where spawncamping is allowed.

[Shadow]

We should play some time.

[Pfisiar]

We should play some time.
I've been trying to get some of my friends from superdickery to play. So far, none of the have taken me up on that offer.

[Fluke Hawkins]

TF 2 on the 360. I'm pretty bad at it, but I'm decent with demo and heavy, since there isn't as much aiming involved. I'm mainly trying to 1k The Orange Box, and the TF2 stuff and the Portal level challenges are the only thing I've left.

[Shadow]

You can cheat for the portal level challenges but the TF2 stuff you just need to do yourself, you achievement whore.

[Orayn]

I still play regularly on the /v/ and /co/ servers. Shit's fun. I hope the Scoot gets something to improve his survivability in his update, because Scouts are pretty much made of paper right now. (The Scattergun is still nice, though.)

[Kant]

Playing as a scout I generally just run in a set course, taking out any snipers, engies, or medics. You see any larger group, you run away unless they look really injured.

[ROFLCOPTER]

New update. Pretty much nuked stickies and fixed some exploits.

[Pfisiar]

New update. Pretty much nuked stickies and fixed some exploits.
they needed to nerf stickies to a large extent.

[ROFLCOPTER]

agreed

[jok3r]

i should really start playing this.

[Shadow]

they needed to nerf stickies to a large extent.
Thanks cause you play as an enge.

[Pfisiar]

Thanks cause you play as an enge.
Do you think it's fair that a single sticky can blow up a sentry? I think the engineer should have a fair chance of keeping it up.

[Shadow]

Do you think it's fair that a single sticky can blow up a sentry? I think the engineer should have a fair chance of keeping it up.
I'm not a fan of games where two turrets in a hallway make it so a team can't win.

I think the turret is a bit overpowered.

[Kant]

Are you kidding me? As a pyro, if I get close enough, I can circle strafe and kill a lvl3 sentry.

Hell, I've done it as a scout.

[Keeper]

I still play regularly on the /v/ and /co/ servers. Shit's fun. I hope the Scoot gets something to improve his survivability in his update, because Scouts are pretty much made of paper right now. (The Scattergun is still nice, though.)

I don't play much anymore, but when I do it's mainly on the /v/ servers. What's your username?

[ROFLCOPTER]

:bump:

[Kant]

I ÷÷÷÷ing hate snipers.

So damn much. I also hate shitty medics, or pansy ass medics who have 94% charge and won't go in for the attack with you.

It's like "I'm a pyro, you can uber me in like 2 seconds. WHY WOULD YOU NOT DO SO?"

[ROFLCOPTER]

I ÷÷÷÷ing hate snipers.

So damn much. I also hate shitty medics, or pansy ass medics who have 94% charge and won't go in for the attack with you.

It's like "I'm a pyro, you can uber me in like 2 seconds. WHY WOULD YOU NOT DO SO?"

Cause they think the Heavy is the only good thing to uber.

Once I ubered a spy. Fun stuff.

[Kant]

Cause they think the Heavy is the only good thing to uber.

Once I ubered a spy. Fun stuff.

Heavy is a really contextual guy to uber. Since he moves so slowly and does so little damage from far away, you don't have the chance at killing EVERYTHING like you do with a pyro. Pyro's, generally, are the best ubers, because they're fast, they don't need to reload, and they deal lots of damage up close.

[ROFLCOPTER]

Also, my steam account name is Lokisfaithful. It's the only one. Send me a friend invite or somethin.

[Kant]

Mine's either kant169 or Gerlach. Check me out, because I can't use internet (though I can use online games...I know, it's odd) on my computer.

[Shadow]

Account name: Shadowchu
Nick: "Yablonski, your badge!"

[ROFLCOPTER]

I added both of you.

[Zindaras]

I did a bit of achievement farming a long time ago (for the Medic pack), but I don't like it (it's fake), so now I just see what I get. I never went to one of those crazy servers, I'm too much of a statistics-freak to cheat on reality. I'm pretty good as any class, except Spy. I prefer to play as Medic, especially on American servers where the lag makes it difficult for me to keep up with the quick-reflexes shooting (headshot sniping is a very big challenge). My best run so far has been a massive 26-minute, 85-point, 48-assist, 19-ubercharge run as Medic (which was unfortunately cut short by the end of the game). It probably wasn't the best run from the team's perspective (early retreat from ubering), but it was awesome all the same.

My favourite map is Warpath. It's fairly straightforward and it's impossible to set up an unbeatable defense.

Sentry Guns aren't that difficult to destroy. Uber-Demo can kill any stationary defense. Kritzkrieg Soldier, or an Uber-Pyro if the guns are close also work.

I like the extra weapons and achievements, but it's semi-annoying that we'll probably see Scoutspam everywhere. I hope my standard server (I generally play on No Heroes, which is excellent) doesn't get it that much, as it's very serious and usually bans people who play as individuals.

My account name is Zindaras. I'd like to play a game with some of you guys some time.

[ROFLCOPTER]

I did a bit of achievement farming a long time ago (for the Medic pack), but I don't like it (it's fake), so now I just see what I get. I never went to one of those crazy servers, I'm too much of a statistics-freak to cheat on reality. I'm pretty good as any class, except Spy. I prefer to play as Medic, especially on American servers where the lag makes it difficult for me to keep up with the quick-reflexes shooting (headshot sniping is a very big challenge). My best run so far has been a massive 26-minute, 85-point, 48-assist, 19-ubercharge run as Medic (which was unfortunately cut short by the end of the game). It probably wasn't the best run from the team's perspective (early retreat from ubering), but it was awesome all the same.

My favourite map is Warpath. It's fairly straightforward and it's impossible to set up an unbeatable defense.

Sentry Guns aren't that difficult to destroy. Uber-Demo can kill any stationary defense. Kritzkrieg Soldier, or an Uber-Pyro if the guns are close also work.

I like the extra weapons and achievements, but it's semi-annoying that we'll probably see Scoutspam everywhere. I hope my standard server (I generally play on No Heroes, which is excellent) doesn't get it that much, as it's very serious and usually bans people who play as individuals.

My account name is Zindaras. I'd like to play a game with some of you guys some time.

Huh... I play on No Heroes as well.

Sent a friend invite.

[Zindaras]

I ÷÷÷÷ing hate snipers.

So damn much. I also hate shitty medics, or pansy ass medics who have 94% charge and won't go in for the attack with you.

It's like "I'm a pyro, you can uber me in like 2 seconds. WHY WOULD YOU NOT DO SO?"

94% charge isn't actually that much. Depending on how far the Medic is away from the frontline, it can be suicide to go in. To be honest, I think most people don't take enough care with their Medics. Especially if they're not ubering, protecting your Medic is vital.

[Kant]

I love when you're starting to do REALLY well (like, let's say, a 30 assist streak as a medic, or a 20 kill streak as a scout), and you start to get the most intense video-game related adrenaline rush ever, trying to keep yourself alive.

[Fluke Hawkins]

Played a game on well. Four of five games, we scoutrushed and won in less than 2 minutes a piece.

:V

EDIT: Speak of the devil. Or the annoying bostonian. (http://www.teamfortress.com/scoutupdate/)

[Kant]

÷÷÷÷ that.

I want to run faster, not stun random people.

[notallama]

i like to double jump.

depends on how many balls you get/recharge on them/stun length/whatever, thoguh.

[Zindaras]

This is superior to double jumping. It also makes the Scout a nice defensive tool, which is very saddening indeed (it was difficult enough to break through defense already). I don't think I'll be ubering a lot of heavies anymore.

[Penner]

Huh... I play on No Heroes as well.

Sent a friend invite.

....I do to, so do all my friends. If you see Bobbsey, that's meh.

[bun_bot]

I'll leave then.

[Oryx]

if you see Oryx on No Heroes, thats the other Bobbsey.

(steam is; Oryx)

[bun_bot]

I'm like slavery!

[bun_bot]

:D

[Kant]

]http://i44.tinypic.com/2zguck3.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/v8o5g7.jpg

[Fluke Hawkins]

This energy drink may be... interesting. We shall have to see.

[Kant]

I love Dodgers:1, Giants:0

[Cara]

Sadly, my clan's TF2 server has died, so I left for the greener pastures of L4D.

[Oryx]

Someone (not me because im not that active on ts) should make a source group for steam.

We can track all of our bitch asses down, so we know whatsup and who is online playing what... just a thought.

[Cara]

I'm not entirely sold on the energy drink, giving up the pistol is a huge loss for the scout.

[Van]

I'm not entirely sold on the energy drink, giving up the pistol is a huge loss for the scout.

Combined with what looks like a low damage, high knockback Scattergun replacement, Scout'll be lacking some serious offensive power. Though it is quite obvious that this update is intended to make the scout a more viable choice when your team is on defense, as the Scout is already crazy powerful offensively for someone who know what they're doing.

[Cara]

I play defense scout all the time.

It works.

[Van]

I play defense scout all the time.

It works.

Indeed, as I've seen. But he's clearly not intended to be, and generally only really good players can play even a regular Scout well.

I imagine the stun ability will be incredibly useful, and probably abused to all hell once someone figures out how to break it

[Zindaras]

I'm not entirely sold on the energy drink, giving up the pistol is a huge loss for the scout.

I agree. Pistol is a nice long-distance weapoin. Without it, Scout has a lot of trouble. In maps with a lot of close areas, the Energy Drink could be very useful. It also depends on the speed bonus. If it allows a Scout to close the distance quickly enough, it wouldn't be that bad an idea.

Defense Scout is actually maybe even more annoying than offense Scout. Scouts are very good for an early rush, but once defenses are up, they generally have a lot of trouble getting through. Defensive Scouts can play hit&run a lot better.

[Zindaras]

http://steamcommunity.com/groups/TehSource.

I'm not sure if I need to invite people or if people can apply, but meh, whatever.

[Cara]

Typically the scout can do the hit and run crap better on a larger, more open map. They typically get screwed on maps like Broma, when the defense can camp a single room with two sentries.

Also, group is by invite only. Check top right.

[Zindaras]

Yeah, I guess nobody else cares enough about TS to join, right? :V

(Yeah, it really was a conscious decision)

Edit: Publicized.

[Cara]

I joined.

[Kant]

The Force of Nature's going to be low damage?

I thought it was going to be higher damage, lower range, fewer shots (it's referred to as a double-barrelled shotgun in the Russian or French versions)

[Cara]

The "word on the street" I've heard is less damage, high knockback.

[Kant]

The "word on the street" I've heard is less damage, high knockback.

fuck 'dat

edit-so it looks like I'm only going to be using BONK out of the unlocks (at least, more often than the others, I imagine that the other unlocks'll have purposes in some situations, and, like the leafblower, will be shown to be more useful later on)

edit-and this isn't to say that the Sandman doesn't look useful to me, but it just seems to be complete murder to the scout's offencive abilities. Since I usually play 2fort, I'd like to have the ability to be offencive or defencive.

[Jenius]

2fort is a terrible map just fyi.

[Kant]

2fort is a terrible map just fyi.

Oh, of course. It's the fact that the map leads to stalemates that makes it so fun for a scout--the engies eventually get bored and move their SG's downstairs, because it nets them way more points. Then I can run in and grab the intel. After that everyone flips a shit and puts defence back upstairs, which lets me run around killing people downstairs, until they move their SG's back downstairs.

Yeah, when the engies are actually good and one has a sentry downstairs and one has one upstairs, and they keep it there, then yeah, as a scout I'm almost worthless. But that hardly ever happens, because the guys who play CTF_2fort never actually play the CTF part, they always just shoot at each other and try to get the most points.

edit-I play on the Couch server, which limits the # of engies to 2, which balances the map out far more.

[Jenius]

Class restrictions are lame unless they're sweeping ones designed to make not the entire team one class. (Like every class limited to 2 or 3 depending on sever size).

[Cara]

A good map wouldn't need class restrictions.

[Kant]

Besides 2 for engie, it's like 4 for all others classes.

Ends up pretty balanced, though good snipers ruin it.

But hey, good snipers always ruin shit.

[Jenius]

A good map wouldn't need class restrictions.

Pros have class restrictions on the 6v6 and 8v8 teams so yes, the game does need it to some extent for balance. (Protip: Engy aint one of them).

Then again the game was designed to be incredibly newbie friendly.

[Kant]

Well that's because past a certain level of play, SGs become worthless. Well placed sentries are pretty much natural selection in action--a good pyro or soldier or demo can murder them ridiculously fast. It's just that you don't get that many players like that in most servers.

[Shadow]

Pros have class restrictions on the 6v6 and 8v8 teams so yes, the game does need it to some extent for balance. (Protip: Engy aint one of them).

Then again the game was designed to be incredibly newbie friendly.
There are certain classes made to be noob friendly but to play a class well it takes practice.

Like Pyro may seem to be a really retard class but if you actually want to survive you can't just go "lol fire".

[Kant]

It's actually amazing how well the backburner and leafblower are balanced. Once you become a good player, you pretty much drop the backburner for the leafblower (also did they change the way backcrits occur? It seems that the backburner doesn't work on anyone but me)

[Cara]

Actually, the backburner is still better for playing the pyro on most maps, because you're an idiot if you run out and try and kill people. You should never be in a situation where you need to reflect shit.

[Shadow]

It's actually amazing how well the backburner and leafblower are balanced. Once you become a good player, you pretty much drop the backburner for the leafblower (also did they change the way backcrits occur? It seems that the backburner doesn't work on anyone but me)
wtf is the leafblower? link me

and backburner works for me but you gotta be right behind them. Off to the side doesn't really work but the fact that you do insta crit from it makes it worth it.

[Kant]

Actually, the backburner is still better for playing the pyro on most maps, because you're an idiot if you run out and try and kill people. You should never be in a situation where you need to reflect shit.

It's pretty good for neutralizing soldiers in bottlenecks (in Badwater Basin, Gold Rush), I've seen Pyros completely fuck up my scout game by bouncing and then alighting me before I can land and start jumping again.

edit-leafblower is the normal pyro flamethrower

[Shadow]

oh, that shit.

I've never used the reflect thing. It's faggy.

[Kant]

Faggy...ALL THE WAY TO THE BANK!

[Van]

Leafblower is amazing. I took out 3 opponents, a SG, and a Dispenser with a single reflected crit rocket on the bridge in 2 fort. As soon as you get used to it, the reflection ability is your best weapon.

Also effective for stopping an opening sticky bomb trap.

[Cara]

Leafblower is amazing. I took out 3 opponents, a SG, and a Dispenser with a single reflected crit rocket on the bridge in 2 fort. As soon as you get used to it, the reflection ability is your best weapon. You were also a sitting duck for being one of the slowest classes with the second lowest HP out in the open in the enemy base.

Also effective for stopping an opening sticky bomb trap.
Isn't that what the shotgun is for?

[Van]

You were also a sitting duck for being one of the slowest classes with the second lowest HP out in the open in the enemy base. And lived :V
Isn't that what the shotgun is for?
Never tried it, the relect thing has always worked for me.

[Zindaras]

I think Backburner is better in most maps, where you can actually get behind people. In the maps where the main strategic option is to run into each other at one point, Leafblower is better, to get rid of stickies/rockets. Also, it makes the Pyro a nice defensive tool in maps like Gravel Pit where it can defend SGs from rockets. Overall, though, I haven't been burning a lot of backs with the Backburner (people don't usually stand still when you get behind them), so maybe the Leafblower is actually better.

*shrugs*

Also, I don't mind class limits. I think it's better for the game.

[Keeper]

I don't care if it's not as good competitively, the poofer is fucking fun.

Sometimes I stick (poof only) on my name and try to get kills using mouse2 exclusively.

[Shadow]

Maps worth playing: Dustbowl and Goldrush

[Jenius]

Maps worth playing: Dustbowl and Goldrush

Scouts are terrible on both of those maps and goldrush sucks regardless.

And before I hear some noob (likely kant) scream how many people they pwned on one of these maps with a scout that's because you're playing against shitty people. Both of these maps bottleneck you into tunnels and if you were equally good with any other class the scout would be the inferior choice.

There's a couple spots on DB not totally ass for scout, but they're few and far between.

[Van]

This thread has inspired me to pick up the game again. But it better not cut into my WoW time. :V

[Purple_Shrimp]

I've got the game, but it doesn't run on my computer. :(

[Kant]

Scouts are terrible on both of those maps and goldrush sucks regardless.

And before I hear some noob (likely kant) scream how many people they pwned on one of these maps with a scout that's because you're playing against shitty people. Both of these maps bottleneck you into tunnels and if you were equally good with any other class the scout would be the inferior choice.

There's a couple spots on DB not totally ass for scout, but they're few and far between.

Fuck that, I play Engie and then I go Demo. I have gotten my highest kill count as a Scout on Gold Rush 2 thought.

[Cara]

I am suprised no one but me knows the custom maps.

[Penner]

This thread has inspired me to pick up the game again. But it better not cut into my WoW time. :V

As soon as we attempt/clear 3drakes 25, Mally 25 and naxx 25, tf2 owns the rest of my week.

[ROFLCOPTER]

I am suprised no one but me knows the custom maps.

I play on a few. Cashworks is my favorite one so far. I could never get the hang of the surf maps though.

[Zindaras]

Scouts are terrible on both of those maps and goldrush sucks regardless.

And before I hear some noob (likely kant) scream how many people they pwned on one of these maps with a scout that's because you're playing against shitty people. Both of these maps bottleneck you into tunnels and if you were equally good with any other class the scout would be the inferior choice.

There's a couple spots on DB not totally ass for scout, but they're few and far between.

So true, though I don't mind Goldrush that much. It has a couple of pretty good spots, though it would do better to have more tunnels so that it might actually be possible to win against a good defense. But I think the Scout update is supposed to help with that.

I am suprised no one but me knows the custom maps.

I've played a couple, but I usually prefer to play the standard maps. They tend to look more finished (I played Balloon Race yesterday, which was amusing but lacked finishing).

So, the Force-a-Nature? I'm not convinced. It looks like a purely defensive weapon to me. Slow reload time and few shells are a serious weakness on offense, plus you don't really want to knock people back that often. Scattergun does most damage at close range, after all.

Also, am I the only one who thought it was amusing that the cloak was guaranteed Portuguese but what the guy says isn't Portuguese at all? :V

[Kant]

The way I see it is that it makes the scout a far less offencive role in terms of damage, but when it comes to, say, picking up the intel, the gun lets you do a triple-jump if you have the bat, and double-jump with Sandman, and that + BONK will let you get past SGs into the intel room

[Van]

Every update that Valve does for a class has one of two intentions: Give a class new functionality for different scenarios (Heavy and Medic gained survivability and new tools), or to solidify the original purpose of the class (Pyro emphasized as an ambush class, particularly Backburner). This Scout update seems to be intended to do the latter: it gives the scout a much greater hit-and-run game that the game intended him to be in maps where there was no intel. I really like the Force-A-Nature, actually: it greatly benefits smart players who can run in, take out an opponent, and get the hell out of dodge before anyone can do anything about it. Combined with Bonk and the Sandman, you can stun an opponent from afar, run in and blow him away, then Bonk out of harms way while you reload.

Scout looks really fun to play with these. I'll still be a shitty scout player, but it's nice that they're adding these in.

[notallama]

so from what i understand, they're giving scouts conc jumping again.

[Penner]

This Scout update seems to be intended to do the latter: it gives the scout a much greater hit-and-run game that the game intended him to be in maps where there was no intel. I really like the Force-A-Nature, actually: it greatly benefits smart players who can run in, take out an opponent, and get the hell out of dodge before anyone can do anything about it. Combined with Bonk and the Sandman, you can stun an opponent from afar, run in and blow him away, then Bonk out of harms way while you reload.

Scout looks really fun to play with these. I'll still be a shitty scout player, but it's nice that they're adding these in.

I personally think that this view is a little bogus for one reason; a scout has to rely on evasion and maneuverability far more than any class, agreed? You're saying that these upgrades will make the scout viable on maps with no intel but I think they'll do the exact opposite if they're equipped. If a map has no Intel then you can assume that the scout will have to chip in offensively by either scoring some kills or hitting an objective- out of the 3 weapons I only see the Sandman being a viable option for this, but this is also a huge disadvantage by losing the double-jump- one of the best chances a scout has if he's stuck in close with a pyro/heavy etc. Who knows, the sandman might be fast enough to pull out and use in time but I highly doubt it. Basically, the only combos I see for any offensive scout outside of a ctf/intel map is

1) Scattergun/Pistol/Sandman
2) Force-a-Nature/Pistol/Bat

This can totally change if I actually see the upgrades in action, but with no double jump it's too scary to go in close combat so you're going to NEED your pistol. This isn't true if you're facing a lone target but in normal games this doesnt occur that often. If you take the force-a-nature the slow reload and knockback is begging for you to hit once in close combat and peg them from a distance with the pistol, but once again too risky to go in close against most classes without the double-jump escape...

I'm not sold on BONK whatsoever at the moment, but it might make a easy escape if taken with the sandman... it just seems like far too much of a loss to lose your double-jump and medium range ability to go in a hit someone in close combat as a scout.

Basically, as far as I can see the scout shouldn't ever be taking more than 1 unlockable at once unless you've got a extremely specialized task to do, ie capping intel or force-of-natureing a medic away from a Sandmanned heavy, etc.

[Cara]

2) Force-a-Nature/Pistol/Bat

This is basically going to be the default for (good) scouts.

[Penner]

This is basically going to be the default for (good) scouts.
Agreed. Good scout players will just hit them back once and keep using the pistol till death. The scout-scout's going to suck if one has a scattergun though. Force-a-Nature's going to make fighting pyros far easier as well.

[Cara]

Also, it opens up totally new avenues for sentry placement.

[Kant]

Well, it will at least be able to deal with an engie next to a sentrygun. I think that, even if I don't have good placement, within 2 lives I can kill a LVL3 SG if it's not fixed. Add this to it and maybe you could be able to deal with SG's far easier.

However, I sincerely doubt that valve would give the scout the ability to do significant harm to SG's, though.

[Cara]

No, it gives the scout one of the best sentry defending tricks.

[Kant]

No, it gives the scout one of the best sentry defending tricks.

Ah, right you are.

[Cara]

What is the best way to keep people from killing an immobile death machine?

By shooting fuckers into it.

It makes Gravel Pit, Canyon and Mach4 different atleast.

[Van]

I personally think that this view is a little bogus for one reason; a scout has to rely on evasion and maneuverability far more than any class, agreed? You're saying that these upgrades will make the scout viable on maps with no intel but I think they'll do the exact opposite if they're equipped. If a map has no Intel then you can assume that the scout will have to chip in offensively by either scoring some kills or hitting an objective.
You misunderstand my statement, but its perhaps my own fault. I am not referring to game balance/mechanics, saying that "omg now scout is good guys!" I'm talking about the design of the game and its interaction on players.

I have a huge love for Valve because they are really, really good game designers. The commentaries during my second run of Portal was almost as enjoyable as the game itself. They take a huge interest in how the player is feeling at any particular moment in the game and what to make sure that the player goes down the intended path. Updates like the Pyro and Scout are meant to lead new players into the class's particular areas of expertise as a learning tool. The Force-a-Nature and Backburner have the same design purpose: emphasize the particular combat and play style of the class that the designer intended.

While it hasn't worked out quite as well as they had hoped, and they've made a few mistakes (the Backburner HP buff was incredibly counter-intuitive to the goal), in general I think it's worked to explain the game to newer players as they get used to the classes.

[Keeper]

Scout update is go.

[Van]

Scout update is go.

Time for everyone to play Scout! :V

Also, if anybody who reads this doesn't have the game yet, it's only $10 until Friday

[Van]

lol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX__swbUwag&NR=1

Best part of the update.

Also, who is "CrBONK!"?

[Keeper]

Me.

Accept my friend request!

[Van]

Me.

Accept my friend request!

DONE!


That's a fun group we had there :dance:

[Penner]

I'm on often, with some rl friends. We need a dedicated server. Pronto.

[Van]

I'm on often, with some rl friends. We need a dedicated server. Pronto.

Is the Source server big enough to host a TF2 game? :O

[Shadow]

Guys, we need to play. :V

[Keeper]

We should plan a time for the weekend.

I'm don't do much on Saturday nights (:(), so that's fine for me. Friday too. What about you guys?

e: Also we should have a clantag.

[Van]

We should plan a time for the weekend.

I'm don't do much on Saturday nights (:(), so that's fine for me. Friday too. What about you guys?

e: Also we should have a clantag.

Sure, why not?

Clantag should just be [TS], right?

or we could do [:v] or [PK]

[Kant]

[:V] is win

Also I like this update, but I'm going to like it more when scrubs stop playing scout. I'm a pretty good scout, but honestly I've never been able to do scout battles (esp on a laptop with a shitty connection). The fact that everyone's trying to get Batter Up and is using the Force-a-Nature ain't helping things.

[Van]

[:V] is win

Also I like this update, but I'm going to like it more when scrubs stop playing scout. I'm a pretty good scout, but honestly I've never been able to do scout battles (esp on a laptop with a shitty connection). The fact that everyone's trying to get Batter Up and is using the Force-a-Nature ain't helping things.

I love it so much. 7+ Scouts against 2 Heavies with Natasha is just f'ing hilarious.

Plus, it makes for fun Scout nicknaming (see mine and Keeper's) :V

[Shadow]

I'm a terrible scout. Basically waiting for achievement servers to update so I can get all the shit.

[Kant]

Oh yeah, when I get tired of playing scout I generally just go medic.

You get so many points and you can basically save the team, because since so many guys go scout, and there are limited #'s of medpacks, everyone dies really fast (I've seen maps where just 4 guys were alive at one point, on a 32 man server).

So you do that.

Plus you can uber a pyro and get #texas points.

[Shadow]

I'm a pretty good medic but you're not going to see anything fancy from me. If my team is dumb I'm going to be bad. If the team is good I'll do good.

I prefer sniping a whole lot. Lots of people hate us but I'm okay with that. :V

[Penner]

Basically every class is around 9-10 hours, but my scout and medic are topping off at 11 hours each, and we need to get a dedicated server!

[Penner]

Heads up that TF2 is on sale on Steam for Half price this week. Now's the time to buy

[Van]

So I spent all of today and yesterday achievement farming with the Scoot. After some time with the upgrades, here's my analysis.

THE FORCE-A-NATURE
Basically, the Scattergun is obsolete. You can unload both shots and deal 150-200 damage in about a third of a second. The "slow reload" is not really that slow, maybe 2 seconds or so. The sheer speed between the shots is amazing. I was never able to get used to the Scattergun because it seemed to take too long between shots, but this thing really improved my Scout game because it feels more natural. I have not experimented with triple jumping, but it seems pretty superfluous unless you really need the extra boost when jumping backwards. A good retreat mechanic if your hit and run didn't work well, I suppose.

The Sandman
You will dearly miss double jumping. Feels like you move slower too, but that's more than likely not true. It doesn't do any more damage than the normal bat, so it comes down to the stun and the taunt. The stun ball is pretty hard to aim at longer distances and is a unreliable tactic most of the time. There are situations where it really shines though. The stun can wreck a Heavy's assault and put a stop to ubers better than anything else in the game. If you're defending a point and waiting for an uber to come in and f-up everything, the Sandman can give you a hell of an advantage. The real downside to the stun is that you only have one baseball. You have to either quickly retrieve it (impossible 80% of the time), get a ball from another scout, or restock at a dispenser/cabinet.
I mentioned the taunt: Scouts now have an instant kill taunt when equipped with the Sandman, similar to Pyros and Heavies. It's the slowest taunt in the game, so use appropriately for maximum lulz.
A great utility weapon, but during most games the stun won't matter or its better to double jump. Learn to use it right and bring it out during stalemates.

BONK! ENERGY DRINK
Let's you grab the intelligence past a sentry in 2Fort. That's about all I can think this is useful for. It's a mild annoyance to face against, but the slowdown immediately afterward is almost as long as the effect itself, and you move at Heavy speed. This wouldn't be so bad except for one thing: you can't attack at all. I suppose if you could, it would be too powerful as it becomes a free uber, but as it is it's not very useful. Good scouts can dodge anyway, so it's incredibly situational. Bring it in when facing bastard Engies and you have bad team support, but a good group should never need this.
EDIT: I've just checked the TF2 wiki. You can't even pick up the intelligence. WTF? Worst upgrade ever.

[Kant]

I think that the BONK is pretty much to distract sentries while an uber kills it. That or getting up in an ubers face when they're attacking.

That's all I can see it being really useful for, it's not something that helps you on your own, it makes you more of a team player, which honestly I kinda like because, as a scout, I'm rarely interacting with anyone else on my team besides other scouts, mostly because on 2fort and other intel maps, no one ever tries to get the fucking intel, and on the other maps, no one plays scout (this was before the update)

[Penner]

and on the other maps, no one plays scout (this was before the update)

This is so untrue it hurts.

[Kant]

This is so untrue it hurts.

I haven't played Well that much until now, it was pretty much dustbowl and the goldrush games, in which I frequently found myself as one of the 2 or 3 scouts on the map.

[Cara]

ITT: People who know nothing of the game (Re:KANT) claim things.

[Van]

Sandman ball actually regenerates every 10 seconds. Thing is a BITCH when you get hit by it :V

[Penner]

ITT: People who know nothing of the game (Re:KANT) claim things.

I think I need to play you carados. It'll be interesting.

[Jenius]

I'm a pretty good scout, but honestly I've never been able to do scout battles (esp on a laptop with a shitty connection).
This is basically a giant oxymoron. Scout vs scout is the fight that requires the best maneuverability while aiming properly. Scout vs soldiers and such you can basically circle strafe, mash space, miss half your shots, and still win if your opponent isn't significantly better than you.


Edit:
I haven't played Well that much until now, it was pretty much dustbowl and the goldrush games, in which I frequently found myself as one of the 2 or 3 scouts on the map.
This is because as previously mentioned, both dustbowl and goldrush are terrible maps for the scout. Anymore than one per side in a reasonably sized game is probably gimping your team and even one may be superflous unless they've changed things since I last placed. There's too much bottle necking. If you're playing on one of those maps the usual best bet is switch to your secondary class.

Really every post Kant makes on this game makes me more and more sure he doesn't know what he's doing.

[Cara]

I think I need to play you carados. It'll be interesting.

I'm actually rusty as hell as I don't have it installed on my new computer.

[Zindaras]

I've been playing against the weapons (I don't do achievement servers. They ruin the point of achievements for me) for a couple of days now, and I've noticed a couple of things as well:

Force-A-Nature: The added reload is nothing. I've been trying to get the Scout during the reload, but they reload pretty quickly anyway. This thing is really really good.
BONK: Kant said this was to protect ubers from sentries. That's silly. Ubers are unkillable. I think Bonk is great to protect Kritzkriegs from sentries, or just provide cover for your buddies, because the haze you leave also stops all the bullets. You can put up an unpenetrable wall that way. I must say I kind of dislike the complete and utter invulnerability you have, as it means that the usually required dodging skill is useless. I've headshot Bonked Scouts, lobbed grenades in their faces, and nothing happens. That seems slightly silly. In my opinion, Bonk should give a huge speed boost but not make one completely invulnerable. To make up for that particular nerf, they could make it possible to fire during the boost. On the other hand, that would make the invulnerability curtain strategy impossible, so meh. I mostly see this used by Scouts that want to get through sentry fire. It's not bad, but it works badly if there is any backup for the Engineer. The slowdown doesn't seem to last that long (then again, the Scouts I see using Bonk mostly die before the slowdown wears off), but the Scout using Bonk usually attracts a lot of attention.
Sandman: In my opinion, the single most annoying thing in the game. I think this one is horribly unbalanced. It's actually pretty easy to hit someone with this, especially from close range. And, once that happens, the stun lasts so ridiculously long that the Scout can find the closest Heavy, kill him, eat his Sandvich, then still come back to kill you before it's over. I don't think I've been hit by this once and lived to tell the tale (even if I survived the stun, somebody would get close enough to kill me immediately afterwards). Ball retrieval isn't a big issue. The balls respawn, you can get a new one from a dispenser, or you can just run up and get your old one back. The balls travel at pretty high speeds, so dodging is very difficult. This one hugely nerfs the Heavy. A bulky Heavy with a rotating gun is impossible to miss with the Sandman, really. It also works on ubercharged people, which just makes it more ridiculous. It's difficult enough to get through stuff with ubers anyway, especially with the Pyro compression blasts and Demoman stickies blowing you away. This thing pretty much defeats Heavy/Medic combos on its own. I would compare it to getting killed while eating a Sandvich, but at least you have some control about the Sandvich. This feels more like being killed while accidentally taunting. The loss of double jump is, in my opinion, a slight loss. The pure power the Scout gets from this is nuts. What use is a double jump if your opponent is unable to speak do anything.

I was playing Sniper on an American server. This means high latency and makes it really difficult to get headshots (through practice, I've been managing, but it's still very challenging), especially so on Warpath, which, for some reason, increases the lag I get. Then the Sandman happened, and headshotting just became a matter of not being blind.

I can understand that Valve wanted the Scout to be more than just a niche class, but I think they've overdone it on the Sandman.

@Jenius: I agree with you on Dustbowl/Goldrush. Scout's useless there, even with its massive powerup. I disagree with you on Scout duels, though. As any combat class (except Demoman, but I'm not that good with him anyway), I've had a pretty easy time dispatching circle-strafing Scouts. Their real advantage lies in using terrain advantages and surprising you in close quarters, much like the Pyro (though less so with the Sandman).

[Cara]

Scout is the second best class on Dustbowl, especially the first one.

On defense.

[Kant]

By protect ubers from sentries, I meant from the knockback. Too often I've seen badly done pyro/heavy ubers not do anything due to knockback.

[Kant]

I'm not sure if the Force of Nature is that useful, at least for the next couple of weeks, due to how many scouts are playing. Scout battles generally have shittons of double jumping in them, and the FaN makes you so innaccurate while double jumping. It's good against other classes, but it seems primarily useful when you're sneaking up to people, and the loss you get in long range capability is something the you have to deal with.

I, personally, have gone back to the scattergun, but I'm going to wait until I see more evidence on the topic.

[Van]

I'm not sure if the Force of Nature is that useful, at least for the next couple of weeks, due to how many scouts are playing. Scout battles generally have shittons of double jumping in them, and the FaN makes you so innaccurate while double jumping. It's good against other classes, but it seems primarily useful when you're sneaking up to people, and the loss you get in long range capability is something the you have to deal with.

I, personally, have gone back to the scattergun, but I'm going to wait until I see more evidence on the topic.

I will admit that a Scattergun scout will probably beat a FAN scout. Against almost every other class however, the FAN is a better choice. Also, it's much easier to abuse the sandman when your firing speed is doubled and you can still double jump if necessary.

I tried going to the Scattergun after I felt I was getting better at Scout. Still can't get used to the damn thing, no idea why. I just like unloading two barrels of fun, jumping back and finishing off with a pistol before the other guy can even turn around.

[Penner]

I'm not sure if the Force of Nature is that useful, at least for the next couple of weeks, due to how many scouts are playing. Scout battles generally have shittons of double jumping in them, and the FaN makes you so innaccurate while double jumping. It's good against other classes, but it seems primarily useful when you're sneaking up to people, and the loss you get in long range capability is something the you have to deal with.

I, personally, have gone back to the scattergun, but I'm going to wait until I see more evidence on the topic.

Scout battles are almost NEVER contained to a small area- let alone close combat. the FAN scout, if skilled, should win if they hit just once. Most damage is dealt with the pistol 1-on-1 scout.

[Kant]

Scout battles are almost NEVER contained to a small area- let alone close combat. the FAN scout, if skilled, should win if they hit just once. Most damage is dealt with the pistol 1-on-1 scout.

Yes, but I'd like to have a vaguely accurate sidearm when doing battles like that.

[Cara]

I REALLY don't like I can't get these achievements solo.

[Kant]

We should have a game.

TONIGhT!

[Van]

I REALLY don't like I can't get these achievements solo.

I saw you farming them earlier today :V

Yeah, they're a real bitch to get. Batter Up, Pop Fly, and Batman are easy enough. The rest require some help, luck,. or a shitload of time.

Kant: I'd be down for that. After 10pm EST, if you so please.

[Cara]

Well, you need the sandman to get half of them.

And I was farming for like 2 hours and only got 8. I got so pissed off I went to an empty server to get a bunch.

[Kant]

You are my Steam friend, correct?

Ethan Smith?

[Van]

Well, you need the sandman to get half of them.

And I was farming for like 2 hours and only got 8. I got so pissed off I went to an empty server to get a bunch.

Also true.

I was able to get about 10 in 2 hours, though we had 24 people and all working together pretty well. Each side usually had a Medic, Engie, or Heavy to help out.

Also, environment achievements are impossible.

[Van]

You are my Steam friend, correct?

Ethan Smith?

Nope. Join The Source group :V

[Cara]

Not on the map I was doing it on.

You could actually get on top of the map and smack someone down a huge amount.


Problem is idiots in acheivement servers.

[Van]

Not on the map I was doing it on.

You could actually get on top of the map and smack someone down a huge amount.


Problem is idiots in acheivement servers.

Hmm, interesting.

Yeah, I ran into morons too. Guys who killed charging medics and Engies for no reason, and of course "lol wut" pyros and snipers.

[Cara]

Yeah, I quit the first time because one of the admins in my clan said I shouldn't ban people on our achievement server just because their griefiing because they could be potential members.

:rolleyes:

[Zindaras]

I think environmental stuff is supposed to be done in the arena maps. I saw it happen there, at least with compressed air blast.

Most of the achievements are just a matter of time. I'm pretty sure I'll get them in a couple of weeks...now I just have to start actually playing Scout.

[Penner]

http://www.teamfortress.com/spyupdate/english.htm

DISCUSS

[Van]

http://www.teamfortress.com/spyupdate/english.htm

DISCUSS

So, we're getting the Sniper AND the Spy update at the same time? And are they stuck with only 2 new items each?

Still, the new Spy items look awesome.

[Shadow]

So, we're getting the Sniper AND the Spy update at the same time? And are they stuck with only 2 new items each?

Still, the new Spy items look awesome.

When I play I'm a sniper and really, what they gave the sniper is good enough. The only people I deal with is spies basically. If they gave the sniper better stuff it would be an overpowered update.

[Kant]

I'm pretty sure the update isn't entirely over yet.

[jimbyob]

Who else realllly hates the new achievement system?

[Jenius]

I thought it was pretty funny they listed the scout as a good achievement pack when I think it's almost arguably worse than the medics. I play the scout decently and I must say that practically none of the situations listed in his achievements come up very often at all.

The pyro was done right imo, there are some wonky achievements in there and it can be somewhat map dependent, but I play the pyro casually on and off and I've slowly made progress on his achievements at a very reasonable rate.

[Shadow]

does anybody know an achievement server where I don't have to grind to get them?

I just want to try the new stuff cause I don't play that often.

[jimbyob]

does anybody know an achievement server where I don't have to grind to get them?

I just want to try the new stuff cause I don't play that often.

You are out of luck since Valve are a bunch of turd flinging retards, with the new system you "find" items based on "luck" which is based on the amount of time you play, but the catch is, there is a certain amount of playing time that you have to play to have a CHANCE of getting a new item, it's not even guaranteed, I have played 30 hours and got one item, just my luck I guess, but the new achievement serves are idle servers, so Valve pretty much stuffed up what they were trying to change (people using achievement grinding servers to get new items) and made it into something that is worse for the people who actually worked for the new items. Oh, and you can get doubles of items that you already have designed for a trading system THAT THEY HAVING FINISHED YET, so for the next couple of months you will be getting multiples of crap weapons that you already have while not being able to get new ones, hoo-fucking-ray.

/end rant

[Shadow]

You are out of luck since Valve are a bunch of turd flinging retards, with the new system you "find" items based on "luck" which is based on the amount of time you play, but the catch is, there is a certain amount of playing time that you have to play to have a CHANCE of getting a new item, it's not even guaranteed, I have played 30 hours and got one item, just my luck I guess, but the new achievement serves are idle servers, so Valve pretty much stuffed up what they were trying to change (people using achievement grinding servers to get new items) and made it into something that is worse for the people who actually worked for the new items. Oh, and you can get doubles of items that you already have designed for a trading system THAT THEY HAVING FINISHED YET, so for the next couple of months you will be getting multiples of crap weapons that you already have while not being able to get new ones, hoo-fucking-ray.

/end rant
Oh, wonderful.

I just wanted the new sniper toys, sigh. I suppose I'll go play in an idle server then.

[Shadow]

not happy about the fact that I have 3 uber saws. :rolleyes:

[jimbyob]

Luck finally came my way, I got Cloak & Dagger, Ambassador and the Bow and Arrow in the same day.

[jimbyob]

Added Sniper/Spy milestone achievements as an additional way players can get the new unlockables

Yay update!

[Shadow]

Oh, hurray!

I had gotten all of the sniper stuff as random items already plus the Ambassador, which pisses me off because I've noticed a lot of people as spy just standing around and trying to random fire at me from really far away. I don't think the gun was intended to work that way. I hope they get the trade system working soon because I certainly don't need 3 uber saws. :V

But right now I don't have any of the scout weapons and need the two other spy ones, although I don't play scout or spy often.

[jimbyob]

Oh, hurray!

I had gotten all of the sniper stuff as random items already plus the Ambassador, which pisses me off because I've noticed a lot of people as spy just standing around and trying to random fire at me from really far away. I don't think the gun was intended to work that way. I hope they get the trade system working soon because I certainly don't need 3 uber saws. :V

But right now I don't have any of the scout weapons and need the two other spy ones, although I don't play scout or spy often.

If you want the spy ones just get the milestones, the first to are easy get you the Cloak & Dagger on the second, which is crazy good when use with the ambassador.

I also need the scout stuff, but I don't think the trade thing is coming for months :(

[Shadow]

I don't think you understand, I am atrocious as spy. I just don't do anything right when I play spy.

[mrs_bun]

Alias is a show about a spy!

[Shadow]

Aaand? :P

[mrs_bun]

Just quoting arrested development >_>

[Purple_Shrimp]

I've got all of them except the Razorback, which is okay because the Jarate is basically better in every way. The Huntsman and Ambassador are especially awesome.

[Cara]

I'm still laughing at my deleted post.

[mrs_bun]

Boo, mean. :P

[Cara]

You've got 15 minutes. Read.

[mrs_bun]

Lmao, got it, thanks. Lol.

Also, delete this if you want, obv.

[jimbyob]

I've got all of them except the Razorback, which is okay because the Jarate is basically better in every way. The Huntsman and Ambassador are especially awesome.

The problem with the razorback is that if a spy stabs you, you don't even notice that they have, so they just cloak then come back and stab you again. Also, I just can't get the hang of the hunstman, it just plain sucks at long range.

I also have no idea what the exchange between cara and bun is about

[Purple_Shrimp]

The problem with the razorback is that if a spy stabs you, you don't even notice that they have, so they just cloak then come back and stab you again. Also, I just can't get the hang of the hunstman, it just plain sucks at long range.

I also have no idea what the exchange between cara and bun is about

Or, alternatively, they just headshot you with the Ambassador

[jimbyob]

Or, alternatively, they just headshot you with the Ambassador

That to, on a similar not I have about 25 ambassador kills till I get the Diplomacy achievement. The ambassador is far to good, I solo heavies with it, 2 shots to the head and a heavy is dead + I have awesome aim.

[Shadow]

when I play sniper I get sniped by the ambassador on occasion. :teach:

[jimbyob]

when I play sniper I get sniped by the ambassador on occasion. :teach:

Depending on how close the sniper is I can do this, it's especially good since you can just cloak, get in a position where there head is visible, uncloak, pop then run.

Also to anyone who has the Huntsmen, did you notice that the bow curves a bit when it is fully charged? by curve I mean it curves into your enemy, sort of like a homing arrow, it must be why people can use it.

[Shadow]

I switch between huntsman and the regular sniper depending on occasion. With the Huntsman I find that you want to aim more for an area because you can be super inaccurate and still hit somebody. Plus just lob arrows towards where enemies are coming and you'll get somebody. I also use the Huntsman if I'm going for more mid ranged stuff. I'm still better with the regular sniper though.

[mrs_bun]

I don't know how to play this game. :teach:

[Shadow]

Then don't post, or go play it. :P

[jimbyob]

I switch between huntsman and the regular sniper depending on occasion. With the Huntsman I find that you want to aim more for an area because you can be super inaccurate and still hit somebody. Plus just lob arrows towards where enemies are coming and you'll get somebody. I also use the Huntsman if I'm going for more mid ranged stuff. I'm still better with the regular sniper though.

I rarely use the Huntsmen unless the enemy I want to get is near the capture point or nearing the point with the cart, but yeah, it's decent at mid range. Most of the time I like the normal rifle since you don't endanger yourself and get butt fucked by random spamming pyro's coming around the corner.

I also tried using the dead ringer again today and it's pretty good in some situations, it's amazing against pyro's since the first time they hit you you don't get set on fire. It's also awesome against engies who think they have killed you but then turn around to their sentry being sapped, I did it twice today, it was awesome.

I don't know how to play this game. :teach:

Then learn?

[Shadow]

I rarely use the Huntsmen unless the enemy I want to get is near the capture point or nearing the point with the cart, but yeah, it's decent at mid range. Most of the time I like the normal rifle since you don't endanger yourself and get butt fucked by random spamming pyro's coming around the corner.

I also tried using the dead ringer again today and it's pretty good in some situations, it's amazing against pyro's since the first time they hit you you don't get set on fire. It's also awesome against engies who think they have killed you but then turn around to their sentry being sapped, I did it twice today, it was awesome.



Then learn?
I play mostly sniper followed by pyro. :V

but I still have to work with the huntsman to use it well. There are some maps were sniper is absolutely useless, or at least some parts of it so it makes sniping as an attacker more viable. But Jarate is awesome all around and just fun to use.

[jimbyob]

I play mostly sniper followed by pyro. :V

but I still have to work with the huntsman to use it well. There are some maps were sniper is absolutely useless, or at least some parts of it so it makes sniping as an attacker more viable. But Jarate is awesome all around and just fun to use.

My list goes Medic (cause no one ever goes medic so I always have to do it + I'm hella good at medic and own pyros with the blutsauger) then Spy (Spy is the most fun to play) Followed by sniper (Get my aim better + trying out new items) then pyro (I used it a lot when I was a tf2 noob) then it's about equal hours of everything else except scout which I only use to capture points or rush the cart.

And yes, Jarate is awesome, I love throwing it at people the beating the shit out of them with the Kukri :V, also its awesome cause it gets people that are standing close to spawn taunting like idiots then they are surprised when they get covered in piss XD

[Shadow]

So, the sniper got the short end of the stick in the update. after playing some last night against some good spies and mediocre ones the items really even the playing field for them. I'm not a dumb sniper so I only stand still very rarely and this usually thwarted dumb spies but not the Ambassador really just ruins everything. :(

[jimbyob]

So, the sniper got the short end of the stick in the update. after playing some last night against some good spies and mediocre ones the items really even the playing field for them. I'm not a dumb sniper so I only stand still very rarely and this usually thwarted dumb spies but not the Ambassador really just ruins everything. :(

Technically a spy could kill a sniper in 2 shots with a revolver but because the ambassador is new people just use it more.

But yeah, most good spys just camp back at enemy spawn and shoot snipers in the head and then cloak again as soon as the sniper notices.

[Shadow]

Technically a spy could kill a sniper in 2 shots with a revolver but because the ambassador is new people just use it more.

But yeah, most good spys just camp back at enemy spawn and shoot snipers in the head and then cloak again as soon as the sniper notices.
Some spy was backstabbing me when I had my back to a wall which pissed me off too.

I was okay with people backstabbing me all the time as a sniper, it just happens that way but now I'm getting shot at more. Really, I don't need more threats.

Another thing, the huntsman is easy mode for a sniper. I've been killed by snipers using the huntsman because they just lob a bunch of arrows in a hallway randomly and they'll get somebody. I have to say I'm guilty of this too but that just seems like the way the gun works.

[jimbyob]

Some spy was backstabbing me when I had my back to a wall which pissed me off too.

I was okay with people backstabbing me all the time as a sniper, it just happens that way but now I'm getting shot at more. Really, I don't need more threats.

Another thing, the huntsman is easy mode for a sniper. I've been killed by snipers using the huntsman because they just lob a bunch of arrows in a hallway randomly and they'll get somebody. I have to say I'm guilty of this too but that just seems like the way the gun works.

I doesn't matter what angle the spy is as long as part of his knife is behind one half of your body he'll get a back stab, I think it was updated like that specifically so snipers couldn't camp against walls :V

And yeah, the huntsman is better for spamming arrows, another reason I like the sniper gun better, if I wanted to spam something I'd spam rockets as a soldier.

[Shadow]

I doesn't matter what angle the spy is as long as part of his knife is behind one half of your body he'll get a back stab, I think it was updated like that specifically so snipers couldn't camp against walls :V

And yeah, the huntsman is better for spamming arrows, another reason I like the sniper gun better, if I wanted to spam something I'd spam rockets as a soldier.

Well, basically the Huntsman makes sniper a more noobly class, which a lot of noobs play anyway.

and fuck spies. Unless they are on my team contributing. :teach:

[Shadow]

Angry that I have 7 medic and 6 pyro weapons. :rolleyes:

[jimbyob]

Well, basically the Huntsman makes sniper a more noobly class, which a lot of noobs play anyway.

and fuck spies. Unless they are on my team contributing. :teach:

Spy is my favourite class :V

But really a team can't win with at least one spy, sapping sentries is just so important. Also, today I sapped a group of 3 sentries and shot 2 engies in the head while standing on a Dispenser was the most epic sapping ever.

Angry that I have 7 medic and 6 pyro weapons. :rolleyes:

Yeah, they better hurry the hell up with this trading system, I need the scout weapons so bad and I cbf getting the achievements.

[Shadow]

Actually, I played on a team and everybody was soldiers on goldrush and we dominated. :V

I'm sure people need what I've got and they've got what I need. It shouldn't be this hard.

and spies were really pissing me off today. because the ambassador is just ridiculous, sigh.

[Caldera42]

So I've been playing this game off and on and I'm pretty terrible. How do I suck less?

also my steam ID is [xkcd] Enigmocracy

[Shadow]

So I've been playing this game off and on and I'm pretty terrible. How do I suck less?

also my steam ID is [xkcd] Enigmocracy

Follow a good teammate around so you can learn the good spots to be in the maps.

And play a class that really fits your play style. I'm pretty terrible with certain classes but real good at sniping when I'm on.

[jimbyob]

Actually, I played on a team and everybody was soldiers on goldrush and we dominated. :V

I'm sure people need what I've got and they've got what I need. It shouldn't be this hard.

and spies were really pissing me off today. because the ambassador is just ridiculous, sigh.

Other team must of been terrible or your team was hella good because you can pretty much counter soldiers with Sentry's, Heavys or Demospam.

So I've been playing this game off and on and I'm pretty terrible. How do I suck less?

also my steam ID is [xkcd] Enigmocracy

Play Pyro :V

But seriously, find a class you like and play with it a lot, watch what better players do and try to copy them, basically what Shadow said, I can't really help much unless you're class specific.

[Shadow]

Other team must of been terrible or your team was hella good because you can pretty much counter soldiers with Sentry's, Heavys or Demospam.

they had a bunch of sentries but we rocket spammed them. :V

[jimbyob]

they had a bunch of sentries but we rocket spammed them. :V

They obv should have tried something else if sentry's weren't working :V

[Shadow]

It went really quickly. I doubt they had time to figure it out.

[jimbyob]

Were you close to the checkpoint when this happened? because that's more believable, but soldier rushing the whole level is way insane.

[Shadow]

As a team we decided to all go soldier on Goldrush. The first check point doesn't really have that great of places to hide sentries so we spammed those hard and before they could get some level threes up at the second point we blew all their shit to hell.

[Jenius]

Soldier is the skill class.

[Shadow]

Soldier is the skill class.

It's actually harder than you think, you twat.

[Jenius]

Soldiers are hard to play really well, but almost anybody can rack up a decent kill/death ratio with them after a bit of experimentation. Shooting at people's feets and spamming rockets at high population density corners (lol crit rocket) is not that difficult to get used to.

[jimbyob]

The hardest class is scout IMO, everything else is easy.

[Jenius]

I started on scout and it's still pretty rare for me to do well on score, but I tend to play off and on. I tend to fair the best score wise when the game is pretty equal, if it's a roll either way there's not much for me to do other than cap stuff fast.

I eventually got decent but when I tried playing recently I realized I wasn't very good anymore.

[Caldera42]

Play Pyro :V

But seriously, find a class you like and play with it a lot, watch what better players do and try to copy them, basically what Shadow said, I can't really help much unless you're class specific.Oddly enough, I almost always play pyro. So that's class specific. Should I be using the flare gun? I really like the shotgun but it seems almost every pyro I see uses the flare gun.

[Cara]

If you're going to play a Pyro, don't play it like a moron and charge into battle.

[jimbyob]

I started on scout and it's still pretty rare for me to do well on score, but I tend to play off and on. I tend to fair the best score wise when the game is pretty equal, if it's a roll either way there's not much for me to do other than cap stuff fast.

I eventually got decent but when I tried playing recently I realized I wasn't very good anymore.

That's the thing with scout, it really embodies the "team" in tf2, you don't get many points but you can push the cart/steal the point easier than any other class

Oddly enough, I almost always play pyro. So that's class specific. Should I be using the flare gun? I really like the shotgun but it seems almost every pyro I see uses the flare gun.

Have you got the back burner as well? if so I recommend using it, to be good with pyro you should camp around corners and rape anyone who comes around the corner, try to wait till they come running past you and flame the crap out of there back or jump people from behind, never run straight at someone from the front because every class can kill you from the front, you want to hit them in the back for critical hits, depending on what map you play there are a few tricks, like moving under sentry's built on the edge of something and killing it slowly from the bottom. I use the flare gun regularly, its your main bet against anyone that is to far away to burn IE snipers, and if you hit someone twice with the flare gun you get mini crits (though they don't show up as mini crits) but you do extra damage to targets that are on fire, though it is really hard to use and requires some practice to get use to.

[Shadow]

If you're going to play a Pyro, don't play it like a moron and charge into battle.

Haha, tell most people who tell Pyro that.

[Cara]

Haha, tell most people who tell Pyro that.

I just called them morons. I see no reason to tell them that.

[jimbyob]

Obviously Pyro's should run straight towards Heavies, Backburner blazing it is the best plan after all.